[Green Left Weekly's Coral Wynter & Jim McIlroy interview the Chilean-born author of Understanding the Venezuelan Revolution, Marta Harnecker, about Venezuela's experiment in popular power. --Ed]
Marta Harnecker: Venezuela’s experiment in popular power
By Coral Wynter & Jim McIlroy - Green Left Weekly
November 30, 2006
Marta Harnecker is the Chilean-born author of Understanding the Venezuelan Revolution (Monthly Review Press, 2005) and other books dealing with revolution and Latin America. She has been an active participant in Venezuela’s Bolivarian revolution and an adviser to that country’s socialist president, Hugo Chavez.
Harnecker has been involved in the formation and development of Venezuela’s Communal Councils — bodies intended to be vehicles for popular power and public participation in the process of creating “socialism of the 21st century”. Harnecker was interviewed by Green Left Weekly in late October.
How were the Communal Councils created and how is the process going?
What I have done in the past year is to look for interesting experiences, to find people who can exchange experiences. In Cumana, [in north-eastern Venezuela], I discovered that an organisation had existed for many years before the Communal Councils came into being. It was organised within a very small space, smaller than a barrio (neighbourhood), 200-400 families. And in some rural zones, you need even less, say 100 families, in an area where everybody knows each other, and you don’t even need transport to get to meetings. It’s easy to meet. It is a space that allows everyone to participate.
Evidently, the people who thought about this, discovered that such a small space allows the people who do not normally have a great ability to express themselves … to express their opinions and to make decisions. As Freddy Bernal [mayor of Libertador municipality in central Caracas] said, [the Communal Council] is a basic cell of the future society.
If we are successful in constructing communities that orientate toward solidarity, the people will be concerned with the poor people who live in their area. Within [a framework of] solidarity, they look for a solution for this sector …
Chavez was looking at different formulas for popular organisations. The Bolivarian Circles are more within a broad political framework. They are organisations aimed at political power. The Communal Councils include both those who are with Chavez and those who are not. They are the community: the Communal Councils must reflect all the colours of a rainbow; must cover everyone who wants to work for the community, without political affiliations, without government associations …
Through this project, when one begins to work for the community, one begins to put solidarity in the forefront, one begins to be transformed. I think this will replace “Chavismo”. At times, people think that to be involved politically one has to go out with placards, banners, red [caps and T-shirts]. The people in this period in which the world is living think that politics is [limited to a formal political] practice.
If you organise in the barrio, the organisation is on a much smaller scale. You need a person who is flexible, not sectarian, with the capacity to work with everyone — carrying out projects, trying to solve the problems of the people …
In an article I wrote about the 4 million votes that were cast in the 2004 referendum to remove Chavez, I said that 3 million of those did not really vote against the Chavez project. They only voted against the Chavez project as it was presented by the opposition. Only about 1 million who voted against Chavez were completely convinced and knew what they were doing. The other 3 million were influenced by the opposition media, which say the Chavez project is a project of “communism”, authoritarianism, dictatorship …
When people become involved in practical work, they can begin to see that Chavez is an open, direct person, and that the president’s project isn’t what they thought it was. In regard to the election, the problem is that many people are not fully informed. There are many people who are anti-Chavista who have been misinformed by the opposition media in this country. The media do not respect the basic right of people to be properly informed.
Middle-class people are more susceptible to the media’s work. The media manipulates the situation by beginning with small truths, and small failures, which they then exaggerate …
What role does the workers’ movement play in relation to community organising?
Logically, we accept that in general the experience of popular power means that, as it is based on territorial spaces, the workers do not appear [directly] as active members. I remember a very interesting discussion in Cuba, when they were planning popular power through electoral registrations. Inevitably, the neighbour who proposed a candidate in their area would choose the person who could solve the most practical problems within the community. This meant it was difficult, up to now, for the workers to be directly involved.
(click here to view entire interview)
Comments